[FFmpeg-devel] New project using ffmpeg

Tue Jan 22 09:37:07 CET 2008

On Fri, Jan 04, 2008 at 04:38:47PM +0100, Diego Biurrun wrote:
> On Fri, Jan 04, 2008 at 12:42:08PM +0100, Cezary Falba wrote:
> > On 23 Dec 2007, at 22:14, Diego Biurrun wrote:
> >
> >> On Wed, Dec 19, 2007 at 12:25:52PM +0000, Cezary Falba wrote:
> >>>
> >>> On 18 Dec 2007, at 17:34, Diego Biurrun wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> On Tue, Dec 18, 2007 at 11:43:36AM +0000, Cezary Falba wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On 18 Dec 2007, at 08:20, Diego Biurrun wrote:
> >>>>>> Also, you claim that your software is available under the GPL,
> >>>>>> but when I download the source code, there is no sign of the GPL
> >>>>>> anywhere and all files are marked as copyrighted by you or Saffron
> >>>>>> Digital or lack any copyright or license information. This makes
> >>>>>> them effectively non- free.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Also, there is the following statement on your website:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> By downloading our software you accept the GPL licence which can be
> >>>>>> found here.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> This makes me think that you still haven't read the GPL, since it
> >>>>>> contains a paragraph about the need to accept the license that this
> >>>>>> conflicts with.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Releasing your software under a license you have not read is
> >>>>>> tantamount to buying a house/car/whatever without reading the
> >>>>>> contract. I'll contact you in private with some excellent Brooklyn
> >>>>>> bridges that I have for sale at premium conditions...
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Thanks a lot for checking a site and all advices.
> >>>>> I just fixed a website and added a license to both sources and
> >>>>> installers.
> >>>>> It will be highly appreciated if you could re-check that page again
> >>>>> when you have few minutes.
> >>>>> There is no rush as we still have time before we officially release it
> >>>>> to public.
> >>>>
> >>>> I have trouble testing the Mac version since it now seems to require OS
> >>>> X 10.5, but I'm still on 10.4.  Your website claims that only 10.4 is
> >>>> required..
> >>>>
> >>>> You have added LGPL copyright headers to your source files, but the
> >>>> license text you include is the GPL.  This looks like an oversight from
> >>>> you.  Also, your copyright headers only contain two of the three
> >>>> paragraphs commonly used for this purpose.
> >>>>
> >>>> Are you using FFmpeg in GPL mode?
> >>>>
> >>>> I'm being told that the Windows installer of your program is totally
> >>>> broken and installs stuff into C: instead of the path it claims to
> >>>> install to.  It also displays a license different from the (L)GPL.
> >>>>
> >>>> The Windows source package contains a __MACOSX directory, weird.
> >>>>
> >>>> I still find it awkward that the first mentions of FFmpeg, AviSynth and
> >>>> Perl on the above website are not links to homepages.  Instead you hide
> >>>> those links at the bottom of the page.
> >>>>
> >>>> So it's getting better, but you're still not at 100%.
> >>>
> >>> Good to hear from you that we are get better with that.
> >>> I just made some tweaks to installers and website.
> >>> I also replaced license files with proper LGPL...
> >>
> >> Well, we are moving sideways, rather than forward.  Here is a list of
> >> issues, some of which are old:
> >>
> >> - The Windows source code link gives "403 Permission denied".
> >>
> >> - The OS X installer claims to work on system 10.4.6 or later.  When I
> >>  try to install on 10.4.11 I get a message that "10.4.6 or later is
> >>  required", well I thought that 11 > 6, but oh well ...
> >>
> >> - You mark your source files as LGPL 2.1 or later, but the license file
> >>  you include and link to is the LGPL version 3.  What is it going to
> >>  be?
> >>
> >> - You do not provide FFmpeg sources for download.  A pointer to our
> >>  homepage is not enough.  You need to give people the exact source you
> >>  are using.
> >>
> >> - In the paragraph
> >>    Saffron Master Encoder is our in house encoding utility made on top
> >>    of open source projects such as: FFmpeg, AviSynth and Perl that
> >>    prepares your source video to be used with our mobile delivery
> >>    platform.
> >>  the words FFmpeg, AviSynth and Perl should be clickable links that
> >>  lead to each project's homepage.  You have put links below that
> >>  paragraph, but this feels awkward and FFmpeg is missing.
> >>  This is a minor issue, but it would be nice if you could fix it.
> >>
> >>
> >> Overall I have to say this is starting to feel a bit like free
> >> consulting work for your company.  I'm under the impression that you
> >> still have not read the licenses or its FAQs yourself.  Instead you have
> >> me go over the results of your tries to comply with the license.  I'm
> >> not seeing you put in the necessary effort to amend the situation.  This
> >> is frustrating.
> >
> > I've fixed OS X installer, replaced licenses in both installers and source
> > codes and fixed web site. Now there are links in paragraph you pointed.
> 
> The OS X installer is not fixed, it still refuses to run on my 10.4.11
> system, claiming that "10.4.6 or later is required".
> 
> Anyway, others tell me that your Windows installer does display the LGPL
> now.  However, there is no way to uninstall your program.  While this is
> entirely your problem, don't expect us to recommend your program to
> anyone this way.
> 
> > I've also added information about getting FFmpeg source from SVN.
> 
> This is not enough.  I thought I was clear about this in the paragraph
> above.  You need to provide complete FFmpeg source code including any
> modifications you did.  Sending people to our homepage is not enough.
> 
> When I download the Mac OS X source code and try to build it in xcode,
> the build fails because the ffmpeg executable is missing.
> 
> > And I'm very sorry you got that feeling. I fully understand and apologize.
> > I don't want to bother you every time I do some change to the site but me
> > and my bosses really want to be all right with FFmpeg and other guys
> > whose work we use in this project.
> 
> I'll be honest and blunt now: I do not want your apologies, I want you
> to work harder on this and not use me as free consulting labor.  I
> pointed out 4 issues (plus one minor) above, you fixed two.
> 
> If you and your bosses really want to be all right with us and use open
> source code while respecting copyrights and not breaking the law, you
> need to take this much more seriously.
> 
> In one of my mails I asked you whether you used FFmpeg in GPL mode or
> not.  You never answered my question.  I looked myself, this is the
> output of the Windows version you use:
> 
> FFmpeg version SVN-r8797, Copyright (c) 2000-2007 Fabrice Bellard, et al.
>   configuration: --enable-gpl --enable-pp --enable-swscaler --enable-pthreads --enable-liba52 --enable-avisynth --enable-libdts --enable-libfaac --enable-libfaad --enable-libgsm --enable-libmp3lame --enable-libnut --enable-libogg --enable-libtheora --enable-libvorbis --enable-x264 --enable-xvid --enable-amr_nb
> --enable-amr_wb --cpu=i686 --enable-memalign-hack --extra-ldflags=-static
> 
> So you are using it in GPL mode, but what is more important is that you
> also compile with libamr support, which is non-free and not
> redistributable.  As long as you keep distributing this binary you are
> violating the copyright of 3GPP.
> 
> I'm going to make you a numbered list of issues and questions, maybe this
> way you will find it easier to address all of them.
> 
> 0. You are using libamr.  That's entirely your problem, but you are in
>    breach of copyright.
> 
> 1. You are still not providing FFmpeg source code.  You need to provide
>    the exact source code you are using, including any modifications.
>    Pointing at our homepage or Subversion repo is *not* enough.
> 
> 2. If you continue using FFmpeg in GPL mode, the license of your program
>    becomes the GPL.  You have to update your licenses accordingly.
> 
> 3. The OS X installer is broken, at least on OS X 10.4.11, I have no way
>    to verify your claims that you fixed its other issues.
> 
> 4. Have you read the LGPL?  The GPL?  The GPL FAQ?
> 
> best regards
> 
> Diego
> 
> P.S.: Please keep the CC, restoring it everytime is getting annoying.

I haven't heard from you in over two weeks.  Are you going to address
the issues I pointed out above?

best regards

Diego
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